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Author Topic: Party of hate?  (Read 32356 times)
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Gunnerman19
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« Reply #885 on: September 29, 2020, 09:31:03 AM »

And eater would be correct. Toe thinks like all lefties...they make mountains out of mole hills and cry about things they really know nothing of. When the shit hits the fan toe and the others will collapse into a heap of their own cowardice. Sure many claim all kinds of shit but most need their safe place. They are quick to tell everyone else they are nazi, racists, wife beaters and the like yet they get it wrong time and time again. It’s as pitiful as their lives actually are.
Nonsense, well put eater.
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« Reply #886 on: October 01, 2020, 12:12:08 PM »

And eater would be correct. Toe thinks like all lefties...they make mountains out of mole hills and cry about things they really know nothing of. When the shit hits the fan toe and the others will collapse into a heap of their own cowardice. Sure many claim all kinds of shit but most need their safe place. They are quick to tell everyone else they are nazi, racists, wife beaters and the like yet they get it wrong time and time again. It’s as pitiful as their lives actually are.
Nonsense, well put eater.

yeah there's someone on here goes by "lois" who compared our soldiers in WWII -the greatest generation- to these antifa punks running around destroying things . i like a good debate about politics and its only possible if you disagree with someones viewpoints or they disagree with yours, but filth like that goes too far. i never expected anyone here to do something that repulsive.
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Lois
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« Reply #887 on: October 08, 2020, 08:03:32 PM »

The FBI is on record sayong the extreme right is more of a threat than antifa or BLM.  I guess this is a good example supporting this thesis.

Feds say they thwarted militia plot to kidnap Whitmer
Robert Snell, Melissa Nann Burke, The Detroit News

The FBI says it thwarted what it described as a plot to violently overthrow the government and kidnap Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer. The alleged plot involved reaching out to members of a Michigan militia, according to a federal affidavit filed Thursday.

The court filing also alleges the conspirators twice conducted surveillance at Whitmer's personal vacation home and discussed kidnapping her to a "secure location" in Wisconsin to stand "trial" for treason prior to the Nov. 3 election.

"Several members talked about murdering 'tyrants' or 'taking' a sitting governor," an FBI agent wrote in the affidavit. "The group decided they needed to increase their numbers and encouraged each other to talk to their neighbors and spread their message."

The affidavit was filed hours after a team of FBI agents raided a Hartland Township home Wednesday and comes amid an ongoing investigation into the death of a Metro Detroit man killed during a shootout with FBI agents.

More than 12 people were arrested late Wednesday on state and federal charges.

Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel, federal and state officers on Thursday detailed charges and what they described as "elaborate plans" to overthrow the government and kidnap Whitmer.

Michigan State Police Col. Joe Gasper said the department will take swift action against those seeking to harm anyone in the state of Michigan.

"This case is one of the largest cases in recent history that the MSP has been involved in," Gasper said during an afternoon news conference.

"The nature of this case is rather unprecedented, but it does send a very vivid reminder that while we may be in a period of discourse, possibly even divisiveness and fighting across the nation, law enforcement stands united."

The conspiracy described by the FBI specifically involved at least six people, including Ty Garbin, 24, whose home was raided by agents in Hartland Township late Wednesday.

The affidavit filed in federal court details probable cause to charge the six men with conspiring to kidnap Whitmer. Those identified by name include:

Adam Fox
Barry Croft
Garbin
Kaleb Franks
Daniel Harris
Brandon Caserta
Ages and hometowns for all six men were not immediately available.

The investigation dates to early 2020 when the FBI learned through social media that individuals were discussing the violent overthrow of several state governments and law enforcement.

In June, Croft, Fox and 13 others from multiple states held a meeting in Dublin, Ohio, near Columbus, according to the government.

Those present included an FBI confidential source who recorded the meetings. The source has been paid $8,600.

“The group talked about creating a society that followed the U.S. Bill of Rights and where they could be self-sufficient,” the FBI agent wrote.

“They discussed different ways of achieving this goal from peaceful endeavors to violent actions. At one point, several members talked about state governments they believed were violating the U.S. Constitution, including the government of Michigan and Governor Gretchen Whitmer.

“As part of that recruitment effort, Fox reached out to a Michigan-based militia group,” the agent added.

The militia group is not identified in the court filing, but members periodically meet in remote areas of the state for firearms training and tactical drills.

The FBI was already tracking the militia in March after a local police department learned members were trying to obtain addresses of local law-enforcement officers, the FBI agent wrote.

“At the time, the FBI interviewed a member of the militia group who was concerned about the group’s plans to target and kill police officers, and that person agreed to become a (confidential source),” the agent wrote

In late June, Fox posted on Facebook a video in which he complained about the state’s judicial system and COVID-19 restrictions on gyms operating in Michigan.

“Fox referred to Governor Whitmer as ‘this tyrant b----,’ and stated, ‘I don’t know, boys, we gotta do something,” according to the court affidavit. “You guys link with me on our other location system, give me some ideas of what we can do.”

The affidavit describing the thwarted plot reports two occasions when the alleged conspirators conducted surveillance on Whitmer's vacation home — during the day on Aug. 29 and at night over the weekend of Sept. 12-13.

Fox and two other individuals located Whitmer's home and shot video and took photos of it as they drove by on Aug. 29. One of the individuals then calculated how long it would take local and state police to respond to an incident at the property.

"We ain't going to let 'em burn our f---in' state down. I don't give a f--- if there's only 20 or 30 of us, dude, we'll go out there and use deadly force," said Fox during the surveillance operation, according to an audio recording quoted in the affidavit.

In an encrypted group chat, Garbin later suggested that demolishing a nearby bridge would hamper a response by police to the governor's home, according to the court filing.

The September surveillance followed a field exercise in at Garbin's property in Luther, Michigan, where the conspirators allegedly detonated an improvised explosive device made from a commercial firework wrapped in shrapnel "to test its anti-personnel effectiveness."

After a briefing on the plan to kidnap Whitmer, a larger group of the men drive from Luther to the vacation home in three separate vehicles while armed.

They stopped to check the underside of a highway bridge to check for places to attach an explosive charge, and discussed detonating explosive devices to divert law enforcement officers from the area of the governor's home.

“She f---ing goddamn loves the power she has right now,” Fox said during the surveillance operation, according to the affidavit. “I can see several states takin’ their f---in’ tyrants. Everybody takes their tyrants.”

The group later returned to Garbin's property, where they discussed destroying Whitmer's vacation home. "Kidnapping, arson, death, I don't care," Franks said, according to the affidavit.

The group later made plans to conduct a final training exercise in late October but then decided that was too close to the November election, so they moved forward with raising money to procure explosives and other supplies including an 800,000-volt taser. It's unclear when the kidnapping was planned for.

Whitmer's office did not immediately comment Thursday morning, but the governor is expected to deliver prepared remarks on the investigation at 3 p.m. Thursday on her Facebook and Twitter pages.

The criminal case comes after months of state restrictions on travel and business during the COVID-19 pandemic.

“The lockdown has been a lightning rod for anti-government extremists in this country, and Gov. Whitmer has been on the forefront of their targeting,” said Seamus Hughes, deputy director of George Washington University’s Program on Extremism.


Senate Majority Leader Mike Shirkey, R-Clarklake, tweeted Thursday afternoon: "A threat against our Governor is a threat against us all."

"We condemn those who plotted against her and our government," he said. "They are not patriots. There is no honor in their actions. They are criminals and traitors, and they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law."

In recent weeks, the state-owned Michigan governor's residence received security upgrades, including the construction of a new perimeter fence.

The "perimeter security and other safety upgrades" were planned out last year, Whitmer spokeswoman Tiffany Brown said in early September. They were scheduled to start in the early spring but were delayed until recently because of the pandemic, she said.

The cost for the "maintenance" projects at the Lansing residence, which was recommended by the Michigan State Police and the state Department of Technology, Management and Budget, was about $1.1 million, Brown said.

"As a matter of practice, we’re constantly reviewing security protocols and adjusting as needed," said Shanon Banner, spokeswoman for the Michigan State Police, in early September.

"We don’t comment on specific threats against the governor nor do we provide information about security measures."

Come back to www.detroitnews.com for more on this developing story.

Staff Writers Craig Mauger, Beth LeBlanc and Christine Ferretti contributed.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/10/08/feds-thwart-militia-plot-kidnap-michigan-gov-gretchen-whitmer/5922301002/





« Last Edit: October 08, 2020, 08:17:08 PM by Lois » Logged

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« Reply #888 on: October 08, 2020, 08:12:58 PM »

The FBI made arrests in a plot to kill the Michigan governor.  This is the world that Trump has created.

One of the guys is named Fox.  Why do I see irony in that?
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« Reply #889 on: October 09, 2020, 02:10:45 AM »

LOL...some nuts in michigan plot some crap because they feel threatened by antifa and blm and riots and somehow ITS TRUMPS FAULT!
                  FOX NEWS!

what did you expect?
people are looting and burning down towns and running unabated thru the streets and not one nut is going to get the idea to fight back?
get real, we've all been expecting this, and worse.
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« Reply #890 on: October 09, 2020, 02:35:06 AM »

Is Antifa your pet name for wearing masks?
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Lois
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« Reply #891 on: October 09, 2020, 03:15:57 AM »

Hate crimes have increased since Trump was elected president.  I hope voting him out will be the first step to stop this trend.
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« Reply #892 on: October 09, 2020, 01:31:06 PM »

  Please elaborate on your statement, with some detail regarding Hate Crimes prosecuted for activity that has occurred since March 2017, as compared to prior dates, and where, what was the crime alleged, and what was the disposition of such alleged crimes.

  Understand most all such charges are State and Local, and most Hate Crime reports are debunked during the investigation process, whether it be 'election related', 'yard signs' and such, or 'tagging' religious or personal real estate with 'nazi and swastica' or other specific words or symbols.

  Similar for Church Burnings, and other reports, and I wonder if you have found a source of detail that shows dated alleged crimes, and the status of those cases, results of prosecution.

  Often, Members of Congress (Democrats) rail about Hate Crime, and when the camera moves on to another topic, so does that Member... if the media do not return to the 'claim' and discredit the Member overtly for such invective, there is no downside for many such claimants.

  Actual crimes deserve to be solved, and the perpetrators arrested, charged, and jailed, no matter the 'special group' nature of the victims, or the perpetrators.

  Not every interaction with a racial component is a 'hate crime,
or involves racists, or racism, and such claims stir the pot for the sake of causing discord, when waiting for a investigation to be completed, to get the details, is just 'too much to ask' for some, in my opinion.

Hate crimes have increased since Trump was elected president.  I hope voting him out will be the first step to stop this trend.
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« Reply #893 on: October 09, 2020, 06:38:06 PM »

Republican Senator Mike Lee:

“Democracy isn’t the objective; liberty, peace, and prospefity are. We want the human condition to flourish. Rank democracy can thwart that,” he wrote, misspelling prosperity.


Rank democracy?  I posted long ago (can’t find it?) that the Republican Party was the enemy of democracy.  They aren’t even trying to hide their push for a fascist authoritarian state any more.
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« Reply #894 on: October 09, 2020, 08:10:22 PM »

For Joan: Using search term "hate crimes since Trump election"

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« Reply #895 on: October 09, 2020, 09:53:21 PM »

'Democracy' is not the form of government in the United States.

By design, and plan, we are a Representative Republic, decidedly not a Democracy, but a Constitution based Nation.

The Bill Of Rights, necessary to be spelled out and included as Amendments in our Constitution, is all about Liberty, Peace, and Prosperity, along with putting a point on other God given rights.


Republican Senator Mike Lee:

“Democracy isn’t the objective; liberty, peace, and prospefity are. We want the human condition to flourish. Rank democracy can thwart that,” he wrote, misspelling prosperity.


Rank democracy?  I posted long ago (can’t find it?) that the Republican Party was the enemy of democracy.  They aren’t even trying to hide their push for a fascist authoritarian state any more.
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« Reply #896 on: October 09, 2020, 10:09:23 PM »

The United States is a Republic AND a Democracy.  The terms are not mutually exclusive.

The Republican demographic is old, white, mostly male, rural, uneducated, and most importantly and the reason for their attack on democracy, a minority.
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« Reply #897 on: October 09, 2020, 10:43:40 PM »


The Republican demographic is old, white, mostly male, rural, uneducated, and most importantly and the reason for their attack on democracy, a minority.


It's exactly that mistaken view that helped propel Trump into the White House in 2016, and may do so again in a couple of weeks.

It's true that your description fits the majority -- on a percentage basis -- of GOP voters in 2016, be very careful generalizing from a simple, numerical majority to a general and exclusive view.

These figures are revealing:




Please keep in mind that just because someone does not have a college degree doesn't mean he or she is "uneducated." The data indicate that Clinton won 77% of the non-white non-college grad vote. 

At the risk of stating the obvious, even though GOP voters tend to be old, white, mostly male, rural, and uneducated, Trump won the 2016 election. And, as I stated here exactly four years ago, the continued attacks on Trump and his supporters for being "old, white, mostly male, rural, and uneducated," succeeds in pushing voters into his camp, rather than leading them to support his Democratic opponent.

Don't get me wrong. In that post (wherever it is), I stopped far short of "predicting" a Trump victory in 2016. But, judging by others' reactions, both here and in real life (and I live in New York City and work at a very liberal university), I was likely the least surprised person to see that Trump had won. I hope and pray that he does not win re-election, I plan to vote for Biden and encourage as many people as possible to do likewise. But, again, while I anticipate a Biden victory, I would not be more than a little surprised if Trump wins re-election.


http://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2018/08/09/an-examination-of-the-2016-electorate-based-on-validated-voters/

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« Reply #898 on: October 09, 2020, 11:07:00 PM »

I think we’ll find the 2020 results will skew more towards what I said than they were in 2016.

My second point is, not everyone with a college degree is educated.  And, not everyone that is educated went to college.  I define ‘educated’ as having the knowledge and intelligence to make informed decisions and have informed opinions based on the ability to distinguish between what is credible and what is not.
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« Reply #899 on: October 09, 2020, 11:53:04 PM »

20 years ago I arrived at a train station in Prague.  It was late and I had been drinking wine on the train.  I hailed a taxi to take me to my hotel.  Arriving at the hotel, the driver showed me his meter and I paid him with tip.  That he started to hand the tip back should have caught my attention.  I had been in the Czech Republic briefly a week before, so I was familiar with the exchange rate, Czech Korona vs. $s.  Standing there watching the taxi drive away my mental calculation told me I just paid $40 for a 5 minute cab ride, or over 10 times what my hotel later told me it should have cost.

I got conned.  It’s a very unpleasant experience.  It makes you feel foolish and stupid.  No one likes to be conned, and everyone thinks they’ve too savvy, too streetwise and too smart to get conned.  As a result, people have a great deal of trouble admitting they got conned.  It’s too unpleasant, uncomfortable and it makes them feel foolish and stupid, so they avoid admitting it even to themselves.

Trump is a con man.  He’s dumb, but he is shrewd.  Like all con men, he’s knows those he’s conned will avoid reality on being conned.  He counts on that.  Getting conned doesn’t just make you feel foolish and stupid, it makes you angry.  There’s going to be a whole lot of angry conned people out there at some point.
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