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Why is net neutrality so important?

Athos_131 · 7904

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #60 on: December 15, 2017, 02:58:37 AM
The FCC’s net neutrality rules are gone. Now this is what could happen to the Web.

Quote
Let’s talk about the end of net neutrality in terms of a hellscape everyone knows: airport security lines.

The Federal Communications Commission voted Thursday to repeal its net neutrality rules, which since 2015 had prohibited Internet providers from blocking or slowing particular websites. Washington treats it as a partisan issue, but it’s not. A new survey by the University of Maryland shows 83 percent of Americans—including 75 percent of Republicans—support keeping the existing rules after being presented detailed arguments on both sides.

It’s really about what happens to the smallest players in our economy. So picture another place where the little guy gets hosed: a busy airport. Imagine Verizon and Comcast are running the security lines—and websites and services are the ones trying to get through.

With net neutrality, all those sites pass through at the same speed.

But of course, airport security these days is all about a pecking order. There’s regular security and there’s the faster “TSA Pre” line. Then at many airports, if you pay extra there’s a “Clear” line, a “priority” line for pilots and first-class passengers, and even a super-fast celebrity line that comes with organic seaweed snacks (really).

Without the neutrality rules, Internet providers could set up their own fast lanes—meaning certain websites could buy first-class treatment, while others are stuck in cattle class. Providers could sell Internet service in packages, like cable-TV bundles. Service providers would also have the right to set up their own no-fly lists, blocking certain websites that they don’t like or compete with their own business.

For you, certain websites could slow to a crawl. Or perhaps they wouldn’t show up at all.

The problem isn’t what happens to Silicon Valley companies who can afford special treatment. It’s hard to shed a tear for Facebook or Google fighting with the cable guy over who gets to swim around in the largest pile of money.

See it from the perspective of Kyle Wiens, the co-founder of a website called iFixit.com that helps people repair their own electronics. He gets 10 million visitors each month and provides a great public service, but it’s a small business selling replacement parts and tools. Already, his biggest expense is bandwidth.

“I am worried that there will be a fast lane we don’t have access to for any price because we’re just not big enough,” Wiens says. Without net neutrality rules, he says, bigger sites—some owned by the cable companies—could cut custom deals.

Slower speeds aren’t just an annoyance for his readers. Google search results give lower rankings to slower sites. So if iFixit’s pages slow down, its instructions for replacing an iPhone battery could lose their audience.

Small businesses from craft sellers on Etsy to online video stars have raised the same concerns. It crosses the political spectrum: Christopher Ruddy, the CEO of conservative news outlet Newsmax, has asked the FCC to make sure providers can't block or throttle content, particularly news content, according to the trade publication Multichannel News.

Supporters of ending the neutrality rules, including FCC Chairman Ajit Pai, say the concerns are overblown. Pai says ending the Obama-era net neutrality rules would bring back “light touch” regulations from a previous era when providers mostly stuck with neutrality ideas anyway. He says much of the fuss about net neutrality is really about Silicon Valley giants trying to “cement their dominance over the Internet economy.”

It’s true there may be public interest to create fast lanes for certain data—like a telemedicine connection for a doctor. (At the airport, it’s a good thing that pilots get to use a special line.)

And we don’t know if telecom companies would actually make equivalents to TSA Pre, Clear or that celebrity seaweed lane. Comcast, America’s largest Internet provider, says it isn’t interested in blocking or throttling sites, though it hasn’t closed the door entirely on asking them to pay for priority service (which might feel more like a dedicated service).

But providers would have the ability to set up traffic lanes, and likely business incentive to do it. AT&T, which is trying to buy Time Warner, might want to give priority to streaming HBO. Already, it streams its DirecTV Now service to AT&T customers without counting towards their data caps.

What happens if providers do start making service less useful or more expensive? The Federal Trade Commission might be able to intervene, but it has much less power than the FCC at present. Otherwise, we’d have to count on the the market to punish bad Internet providers. Too bad 50 million U.S. homes have either zero or just one internet provider offering 25Mbps speeds.

The deepest impact will be invisible: small businesses like iFixit stuck in the slow lane. Multiply that impact by thousands of sites, we could lose what what makes the Internet so useful in the first place. Without net neutrality, many new ideas just won’t ever take flight.

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« Last Edit: December 15, 2017, 03:00:49 AM by Athos_131 »

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #61 on: December 15, 2017, 03:00:38 AM
FCC Votes To Overturn Net Neutrality Rules, Brings Us One Step Closer To A Destroyed Internet

Quote
For gamers, the end of net neutrality could mean that companies charge gaming networks for money. In a 2014 Kotaku article, news editor Jason Schreier warned that the costs could trickle down to consumers. Also, he asked:

“Worse, what if ISPs wind up separated into factions? What if Sony decides to cozy up with Comcast, paying them a pretty penny to ensure that PSN runs smoothly, while Microsoft won’t give? Imagine having to pick a new gaming system based on what will run more quickly on your network—this could give a whole new meaning to the term ‘console wars.’”

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Offline Army of One

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Reply #62 on: December 15, 2017, 03:01:34 AM
The Trump administration appointees have repealed net neutrality guidelines, opening the door for your ISP to restrict the websites that can be found by your search engine.  They can now even block content, such as KristensBoard.

So are we to face a forced member exodus in the next few weeks?

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #63 on: December 15, 2017, 03:41:47 AM


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Reply #64 on: December 15, 2017, 03:49:27 AM
How long ago was that, Athos? For some reason, I can't seem to find it. (Ten-to-one, it was probably purged.)

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Offline joan1984

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Reply #65 on: December 15, 2017, 03:53:27 AM
 Returning the Internet rules to their former status, prior to the party line vote taken in 2015, is what has happened.

  So, I came to KB in 2008, and noticed no oppression from then to now, prior to the supposed "net neutrality" and now back to normal.

  No big deal, and another Campaign Promise kept.  

  MAGA.

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #66 on: December 15, 2017, 04:02:46 AM
Probably as soon as the vote was taken.

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« Last Edit: December 15, 2017, 04:07:45 AM by Athos_131 »

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #67 on: December 15, 2017, 04:05:28 AM
So, I came to KB in 2008, and noticed no oppression from then to now, prior to the supposed "net neutrality" and now back to normal.


You're so full of it.



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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #68 on: December 15, 2017, 04:10:22 AM
This poll gave Americans a detailed case for and against the FCC’s net neutrality plan. The reaction among Republicans was striking

Quote
On the eve of a pivotal vote that would deregulate the broadband industry, a fresh survey from the University of Maryland shows that large majorities of Americans — including 3 out of 4 Republicans — oppose the government's plan to repeal its net neutrality rules for Internet providers.

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #69 on: December 15, 2017, 04:12:59 AM
joan1984,

What would you do if your Internet Service Provider started throttling, blocking or charging consumers extra to view your own personal website?

Thanks in advance for your response.

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Offline Army of One

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Reply #70 on: December 15, 2017, 04:33:38 AM
I actually had to do my research for this, not so much on net neutrality, but its status in Australia, as I didn't think we had it here—we don't, but the situation is a mite more complex, as you'll see below.

While we don't have Net Neutrality here, we have two things (according to this article here) that work in our favour as a "replacement" of sorts: high ISP competition, and strong consumer protection laws (with a government department to match). So if someone does something unfair, they can rest assured they'll be caught up to fairly quickly. (The recent popularity of TV shows like The Checkout have also made sure these rights are made more accessible to the public.) Given what's been said about Net Neutrality, this is something which the US may suffer from: poor competition, and equally poor competition law. So they need to rebalance the removal of Net Neutrality with better competition and/or competition laws.

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #71 on: December 15, 2017, 04:38:32 AM
You may not think a US decision would effect you but if you try to access a site based in the states -such as KB- it's possible your access could be slowed or blocked on this end.

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Offline Army of One

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Reply #72 on: December 15, 2017, 04:45:38 AM
You may not think a US decision would effect you but if you try to access a site based in the states -such as KB- it's possible your access could be slowed or blocked on this end.

#Resist
Yeah, well, I'll be honest with you: after I sent that last post, I asked myself, "Do you really believe everything you wrote there?" And the truth is, probably not even 50% of it. And you could very well be right, which becomes problematic since a lot of sites that were originally hosted in Australia shifted overseas after the government passed (or tried to; my memory's fuzzy there) laws preventing sites containing obscene content (porn sites, mostly) from being hosted here. And that's before we get started on the purely US-based sites.

We also have a further issue in that, in Australia at the moment, there are existing issues regarding geoblocking, which already prevent us from accessing a lot of stuff. Whether this decision will further that is a question for the ages.

We'd just have to see.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2017, 04:56:48 AM by Army of One »

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Reply #73 on: December 15, 2017, 03:08:03 PM

 Returning the Internet rules to their former status, prior to the party line vote taken in 2015, is what has happened.


And that "return" was effected by a party line vote.

If you're going to condemn decisions made by party line votes, then at least be consistent.



 So, I came to KB in 2008, and noticed no oppression from then to now, prior to the supposed "net neutrality" and now back to normal.

  No big deal, and another Campaign Promise kept.  



So, the entire country and it's entire system of laws should be based on what you personally notice?

Of course you didn't notice any oppression! At that point, providers were gearing up to unleash their oppression, and the Net Neutrality Law nipped that in the bud and kept that at bay -- until yesterday.

Net Neutrality seems like a very complicated issue, but it's actually quote simple. The abolition of Net Neutrality opens the door wide open for Corporations to gain more power and, of course, make more money, at the expense of consumers. That, in sum and total, was the reason the Law was abolished, and Internet freedom was cast by the wayside in favor of hunger for power and profits.

So, in a way, you're right: "Another campaign promise kept."


EDIT: After posting this, I read a Reuters report on the demise of Net Neutrality. The third line in the article is, "The move marked a victory for internet providers such as AT&T, Comcast, and Verizon."





 
« Last Edit: December 15, 2017, 03:34:42 PM by MissBarbara »


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Offline joan1984

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Reply #74 on: December 15, 2017, 04:59:41 PM
  I felt it was obvious to anyone who follows this topic, and thread, that a party line vote is what shoveled in the "Net Neutrality" system, and it was apt that it was a party line vote, that restored normality to the internet system.

  Large players, usually incorporated interests, with shareholders, employees, and customers, will naturally have a outsized interest in public policy such as was the 2015 imposition in this case. It makes sense that those with skin in the game would be pleased with the temporary regulations now voided.

  Is regulation necessary in general when businesses large and small are doing commerce, YES, and regulation exists, with the FCC being the enforcer, as was noted in several articles quoted here regarding this issue. Any number of items were listed, where voluntary agreement was reached, offered and accepted, by Comcast is one cited, and such agreement makes lots of sense where needed.

  The broad brush approach is not necessary, not at this time anyway, and fear of change demonstrated by those who quote all manner of ills that will befall us with the change to the way we handled this area of commerce from its start until 2015, is overstated, here and in general.

  Someone felt so strongly as to place terrorist threats to try and block the FCC meeting this week... wtf? Where issues must be decided, agreements made, I am certain such agreements will be made, with the people we pay to handle liberty of thought, when the need may arise.

  Seems an endless array of 'Regulations' is available to be culled, removed, or adjusted... duplication removed at very least... and freedom restored for all Americans to grow and prosper from their risk taking ventures.

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Offline MissBarbara

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Reply #75 on: December 15, 2017, 05:46:39 PM

  I felt it was obvious to anyone who follows this topic, and thread, that a party line vote is what shoveled in the "Net Neutrality" system, and it was apt that it was a party line vote, that restored normality to the internet system.


"Shoveled in" vs. "restored normality." No biassed language there!



  Large players, usually incorporated interests, with shareholders, employees, and customers, will naturally have a outsized interest in public policy such as was the 2015 imposition in this case. It makes sense that those with skin in the game would be pleased with the temporary regulations now voided.


Yes, that's exactly what I said. "Incorporated interests" (+1 for the wonderful euphemism!) do indeed have an "outsized" interest in public policy, and that interest is gaining more power and earning more money, at the expense of ordinary consumers.

But that's corporate interests (excuse me, "Incorporated interests") and not the public interest. 



  Someone felt so strongly as to place terrorist threats to try and block the FCC meeting this week... wtf?


Yes, some ONE.

And what's your implication by stating that? All those opposed to abolishing net neutrality are terrorists? Just like the fact that the man who committed murder during the Charlottesville protests was a Conservative Republican, so all Conservative Republicans are racist murderers?



  Seems an endless array of 'Regulations' is available to be culled, removed, or adjusted... duplication removed at very least... and freedom restored for all Americans to grow and prosper from their risk taking ventures.


"Risk taking"? The federal government just handed the corporate telecommunications behemoths a license to exploit the general public at will. There's no "risk" in THAT!






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Reply #76 on: December 15, 2017, 06:40:38 PM


We are already fucked beyond belief.  It’s sad that 50% of the population does not give a shit about corporate fascism, but inexcusable that idiots like Joe parrot whatever crap is put in front of him, by Brietbart and similar propaganda ministries.

The U.S. is making a few last laps around the toilet bowl, but the signs are everywhere that our place in the world order, that has existed for 70 years, is ending.






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Reply #77 on: December 15, 2017, 08:16:46 PM
I know more about this now than I use to.  But even if I was still as ignorant of net neutrality as I once was, all I need to know is Verizon was instrumental in the repeal.  I was screwed over so badly by Verizon a couple years ago, that I would go without any phone or internet access for the rest of my life before I would ever let Verizon see another penny of my money.



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Reply #78 on: December 16, 2017, 01:27:39 AM
  Risk Taking can be a euphemism for those who invest, who seek to grow their businesses, their fortunes, on behalf of their stock holders, employees, and the growing customer base they serve.

  Indeed investing, creating further infrastructure, is a expense and a risk. The internet is not a Utility, not owned by local, State or Federal governments, it is available for all to utilize, with the access the individuals purchase from private companies. 

  Services offered differ, some more than others, and the investments made to provide such services, at whatever selection of speed and complexity, is the market which drives our system. Healthy markets promote the growth needed for our Nation to excel in all manners.

  Competitive markets will sort out those who seek to stifle individual citizens, via price or speed for a fair price, or in other manners, as competition will seek to lure customers who are not happy with their current internet access.

  Our focus should be on Franchise Reform, so as to make more competitive all aspects of communication, including internet access, broadband, whatever. The place to address Franchise Reform is the legislative branch, and local city or other governments complicate their constituent's options by offering, for a fee which you may see on your monthly bill, exclusivity of sorts.

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #79 on: December 16, 2017, 03:51:16 AM
The internet is not a Utility,

What a load of crap.

Try functioning without it these days.

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