Guns and such

[Katiebee]

Ok, there are some of us who like punching holes in paper and such with implement sthat allow one to reach out and touch at a distance. And I think I want a spot where I can share my experiences with firearms, and boat when I get a good target result.

This thread will allow us a spot away from other threads.

[psiberzerker]

Okie doke.  Here's one that's always bothered me:

In 30 some-odd years of reading Soldiers of Fortune (Remember that?) the "Ultimate Home Defence" is a 12 gauge, right?  You've heard that, but so far I've seen 1 Vlog mention Hearing Protection.

You ever fired a 1 gauge indoors?

[Katiebee]

I am proud of this session. Yes it was at 7 yards but still, hat is a tight group for a pistol. Considering what I see in the other lanes, i’m much better than 90% of the other shooters in the range.

[Katiebee]

Okie doke.  Here's one that's always bothered me:

In 30 some-odd years of reading Soldiers of Fortune (Remember that?) the "Ultimate Home Defence" is a 12 gauge, right?  You've heard that, but so far I've seen 1 Vlog mention Hearing Protection.

You ever fired a 1 gauge indoors?

only in an indoor range, but I know what the sound would be like. It’s not like you would be doing it repeatedly for long periods or more than once or so.

[Jed_]

Great minds think alike katiebee.  I was beginning to think we were monopolizing that other topic with the smell of gunpowder.

[joan1984]

Nice group, Katiebee!

I am proud of this session. Yes it was at 7 yards but still, hat is a tight group for a pistol. Considering what I see in the other lanes, i’m much better than 90% of the other shooters in the range.

[Elizabeth]

A twelve gage fired indoors sounds like a cannon....!!!
Not to be tested by the way.....just trust me on this...!!!

Love,
Liz


 

[psiberzerker]

A lot of the same videos (There's articles online as well) don't say anything about Training, or Safe Handling.  Just "The Best Guns for Self Defense."  I'm not anti-gun, I own several myself, and I have them locked securely under my bed.  (I live in a step van.)  

However, the advice to "Get a gun" or "Buy this gun," without any discussion of Safety is dangerous.  It encourages people to have guns they don't know how to use, aren't trained to fire accurately under stress (Like a self defense situation) and gives them a false confidence.

"Now, I can protect myself, and my family."  As if guns reliably stop bullets, all by themselves.  Instantly, I might add.  They sell Instant Incapacitation, market special ammo, to guarantee it.  Not if you don't hit them.  Not if you don't hit a target that's likely to incapacitate them.  

Also, I'm just not comfortable busting open shot-cups of 00 buckshot, 9 balls at a time, around the stuff I'm trying to protect.  You might as well throw a dice bag at them.  That's the plan, right?  Protect your stuff from getting stolen?  (I'm armed to protect myself from Transphobes.)  Okay, make that someone who doesn't even know the basics of firearm safety, with a Mossberg "Shockwave."  Is that how you protect your stuff?  

This is bad advice.  This is really Dangerous advice.  This makes homes more dangerous, than if they didn't have that magical talisman of home defense.  It's not a toy, it's not a amulet, it's a gun.  Learn how to secure, retain, and use it safely, or don't fucking bother.

[Elizabeth]

Training is and (ALWAYS) should be paramount to owning any weapon.
Get "instruction first" before you buy your choice of weapon.
There is "absolutely" no sense in owning a weapon if you don't know how to use it or it's capabilities. I have enough weapons and training to keep me reasonably safe (both at home and on the road). I have a 20 gauge that works out fine for both bird hunting and home defense (sure I'd love to have a street sweeper, but I'm not out to start WWIII), and neither do I need or want something that's capable of holding 25+ rounds.
I have a NJ carry and conceal weapons permit (not and easy thing to get, by the way) that lets me carry protection for not just me but for my horses as well.
Safety Starts With Training (The Proper Training For The Weapon You Want To Buy).

Love,
Liz

[psiberzerker]

(I'd love to have a street sweeper...)

Cobray shotguns are utter shit.  

You don't want one:  The Street Sweeper was marketed specifically to Gangs, and in defiance of the "Assault Weapon" ban.  Not unlike the MAC-10, which Gordon Ingram called a "Phonebooth Gun," because you had to be in the same phonebooth to hit anyone.  However, it was also extremely easy to convert to full auto (Only, Open Bolt) with a Dremel, and a pair of pliars.  It was exclusively made to thread into the WerBell canister.  I call it the "Haggis Gun," because it's like the Scotts throwing out a perfectly fine fox, and keeping the Haggis.

My preferred weapon is an Inglis High Power, because it's exempt (Curio, and Relic) from the "Short Barreled Rifle" classification under the National Firearms Act.  It's also a high capacity Browning 9mm (You can get 14 in the grip/chamber, and carry a spare magazine in the stock.  If I need more than 27 rounds of Parabellum, I'm probably already dead.) that dovetails into the wooden holster as a short shoulder stock, for extremely stable aiming.  On the move, it's "Tactically" short, so the retention is extremely good, compact enough to lock up in a small gunsafe (Under my bed) and with available parts, accuratized.  

Another loophole in the Federal Laws is the Receiver is the gun, for the purposes of serial numbers, and registration.  There's a vast aftermarket for the Browning High Power, so basically just the grip (With the dovetail) and Stock have to match.  You can add a modern slide, Match grade barrel, fine tuned polished hammer/trigger group...  I basically gutted it, and increased it's value by a factor of 5, just like a .45 1911 Race Gun.  (Only without the porting, and undermounted picitinny rail for a tacticool light, because then it wouldn't fit in the holster with a magazine.)

Also, a shoulder strap riveted to the lid/buttplate, so I can sling it over my shoulder, and carry it at my hip, like a Purse.  I live in Waco, where I can walk down the street with a Warhammer.  Talk to the cops all the time, usually about armament, because they know that if somebody turns up beaten to death with a Lucern Hammer, they can come talk to me.  (If they can find me.  I'm also already packed, so i can skip town within the hour if the Shit Hits the fan.)

[psiberzerker]

I drill for attacking the Hips, and Pelvis.  For several reasons, but defensively, if I have to draw, and fire (I also have a hip holster, the ballistic purse is mostly to carry it on the Range) it's about halfway between my waist, and their Center of Body Mass, so a quicker shot once I clear, and bring it to Battery.  It's better retention than holding it up at head or eye level, and with practice, it's an easier target to put a snap-shot between the hips.

Anyone who's ever whacked their Coccyx, (Tailbone) has some idea how disabling the pain is.  Good luck fighting effectively, or even holding, and raising a gun, on your ass, with a shattered pelvis.  If that doesn't do the trick (It always has, yes I have tested it, In Combat.)  Then with a semi-auto pistol, followup shots tend to track up into the omentum, "Bread Basket" (Heart, liver, and lungs) then the Head.  So, I can escalate from incapacitating, to mortally wounding, to (Fairly reliably) Lethal Force, as fast as I can pull the trigger.

One of the many things I love about Parabellum is that it's cheap, compact, and light enough to keep firing, until the fight is over.  The "Stopping Power" statistics are based on Single Shot Stops from police reports, and similar statistics.  With a high capacity semi-auto, there's absotuvely no reason to rely on a single shot, which is why modern (Cooper) police, and military sidearm training teaches double, and triple taps.  12+ rounds of 9mm>8 rounds of .45 Auto. 

Basically, what I'm talking about is Weapon Systems, including carry, drills, retention, reloads/malf recovery, and a Plan of Defense.  The first rule of a gunfight is "Bring a Gun."

It gets a lot more complex, once you have to reach for it...

[RopeFiend]

Here's the closest I could find to the targets that my range in Phoenix used to sell.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctX3juq9Okw

[_priapism]

(I'd love to have a street sweeper...)

Cobray shotguns are utter shit.  

You don't want one:  The Street Sweeper was marketed specifically to Gangs, and in defiance of the "Assault Weapon" ban.  

My father has one, and an AK-47, and an Uzi.  And probably a small penis also, now that I think about it.

Says he’s ready for when “the shit hits the fan.”  He’s 75.  They’ll take it from him, pistol whip him, then piss in his skull holes.  But it’s a nice fantasy for him, I guess.

[Jed_]

Most of mine were bought with the thought of putting food on the table the old fashioned way.  Another 1/3 are various handguns, and a couple of those were also meant for hunting.  I have no non-hunting long guns and probably never will.  My .375 Ruger grizzy gun can blow a hole in you so big your kids could jump through, so I don’t see the point of the non-hunting military style ones.

When it comes to those handguns, one gets taken backpacking for bears, cougars and gear stealers.  The others I just like to shoot.  Sure I keep more than one loaded for intruders, that is if there’s anything left after the German Shepherd is done.

I need a holster for my Desert Eagle, my last purchase.

[Katiebee]

There is something beguiling about the combination of wood and steel. Something almost romantic when you combine them and history.

I am a total history buff, and I have been for a long time.

I have joked before that I could equip a rifle squad. The most modern firearms I own are pistols. TThe rest are historical.

I love owning history.

I have two Mosin Nagant 91/30s one of which is an ex-Dragoon. It is some 70 years old. I have two Mosin Nagant 91/30 PU snipers, and one Finnish M38 (Mosin Nagant  91/39 reconfigured from a 91/30). Two Mauser Kar98k rifles, one is a Russian capture, the other is an all matching serial number bring-back that I purchased from the widow of the soldier who brought it back from WWII. I have one Swedish Mauser M38. A Soviet SVT-40, a walther Gewher 43. An SKS, an M1 Garand, an M1 carbine, and a Springfield 1903A3.

Pistols, I have theee historical pistols, a Mauser HSc, two Walther P38s.

The modern ones are a Colt Government model 1911A1, a Browning Hi Power, a Walther P1, a P5, a Walther PPKS, a PK380, a P22,  and a CCP. A Beretta 92FS, PX4, and a M84 Chettah, and finally, a Sig Sauer P226.

People at the range look at me funny when I drag out those shoulder thumpers, especially when they are shooting 5.56mm black rifles. The Mosins are about as tall as I am.

[Jed_]

I don’t have anything historical.  If I was considerably better off financially, I expect that would be a new hobby for me particularly anything from WWII.

[psiberzerker]

Yeah, I live vicariously through Forgotten Weapons.com, and In Range TV, because they regularly Compete (Basically "Practical" shooting, with obstacles) with historical weapons, in Cosplay.  Against "Gamer guns" with quad rails, and high tech sights, and shit.  Ian, and Russel (SinestralRifleman) do it Left Handed. 

There's something really fun about watching a Tacticool tryhard with a Black Rifle get beaten buy a guy, dressed up as a drug mule, with a bale of "Mota" (Simulated) strapped to his back, and a milserp Krinkov.

[Katiebee]

Range day!

Drug the Mosin Nagant 91/30 PU sniper out for some paper punching.

After the first four rounds I remembered where to hold the reticle on the bullseye. The  rest is history. Both targets are 10 rounds at 100 yards.

[RopeFiend]

Nice shooting, Vasilya!  Grandfather would be proud!

[Katiebee]

I’m going to get it under a 3 inch group.